Today Jeff Byer (@globaljeff) talks with Scott Desmond Dahlgren about the past, present, and future of advertising as well as the transition from digital to traditional to omnichannel media sales.
About Scott Desmond Dahlgren
West Coast Digital Sales & Programmatic Lead
Xandr (Formerly DIRECTV)
Jeff Byer 00:07 Welcome to digital rage, the podcast about all things internet and the people that make it great. My name is Jeff Byer. Today we have our first in studio guests. My cousins, Scott Desmond Dahlgren. He does media sales, at Xandr. Xandr is a division of AT&T and he, uh, explains the combination of data from each one of 18 <inaudible> sources so that they can not only target
Jeff Byer 00:33 they’re advertising audiences, but they can, uh, try and keep track of them as well. And, uh, he talks about the differences between online and offline targeting and reporting. So very fun conversation, especially for a this audience, which is strictly online digital marketing and how traditional TV and, uh, and the media that he sells is, it differs from what we do, uh, for PPC on a day to day basis. Uh, and we talk about my history with, with him creating digital and uh, and all the following him with all the companies that he’s worked with and done sales for. And he uses me as a creative resource, which I always very much appreciate. Um, so, uh, beyond that, uh, not much else is going on in the, uh, in the, in the Jeff buyer inc realm. Uh, lots of, lots of proposals out, lots of, uh, work going on.
Jeff Byer 01:37 Um, the, you know, PPC specifically it, we’re doing a bunch of rebuilding and I’m trying to clear off a lot of, uh, lower, lower level stuff off my plate. Get mostly outsourced and get, uh, the bigger projects started. Uh, we got a huge project build a, a relaunch of a, uh, a celebrity brand name that’s coming at the end of the year. So once it’s done, I will announce it on the podcast. You guys can check out my work. But for now, the site that’s up is somebody else’s work and it, uh, quite frankly is not very good. So, uh, we’re gonna have that fixed by the end of the year and we’re launching probably mid November and then a brand new, uh, celebrity and indoors product brand is also going to launch at that same time too. So we’re going to have two pretty large launches, uh, within the next month, month and a half. So, uh, be look beyond the lookout for that. And I will definitely, if you follow me on any social media, best way, best place to follow me is on Twitter. I am at global. Jeff and I will announce all of our product launches there and, uh, you can ask me any questions. Uh, go to byard.co for, uh, anything related to business and contact information as far as website design and SEO. So let’s talk with my first cousin Scott Desmond.
Jeff Byer 03:05 Doug. So today we have Scott doll Graham who goes by guy. He’s my cousin. She works for Zander and uh, he does a lot of advertising, but Dez, why don’t you tell us what you actually do? Scott Dahlgren Hi, Jeff. Jeff, my first cousin. Uh, my name is Scott Desmond Dahlgren and I work for Zander, which is a part of that
Scott Dahlgren 03:31 at T and, T, which also owns direct TV and AppNexus and Warner media. So it’s a large media conglomerate. Uh, and I have 15 years of digital advertising experience where I worked at AOL, Disney interactive and a startup called GumGum. So I’ve been working in the digital advertising industry for quite some time now. Yes. And, uh, thank you for bringing me along and all these ventures. It’s fun doing work for you with all these companies. Yes, Jeff’s been, uh, very helpful, uh, with creative and other things that I’ve needed over the course of the last 10 or 15 years. So it works great. You, you’re the creative genius behind the ads that I sell.
Jeff Byer 04:12 I didn’t, you know, I don’t think of the creative teams, but I liked being, uh, being included. So, um, today I thought it would be fun to talk about some of the, uh, some of the, uh, the terms that you use on a daily basis and, and what you, what, um, acronyms that, cause I remember talking to you one night at a, at your place and you’ve used a bunch of acronyms and I’m like, do you just speak in complete acronyms at work?
Scott Dahlgren 04:41 Yeah, the digital video and just digital advertising ecosystem has really changed a lot in the last 15 years. Um, when I first started at AOL, um, about, like I said, 15 years ago, we were primarily selling digital, uh, banner inventory, you know, banners that are referred to by their sizes and pixels. So four 68 by sixty’s or seven 28 by nineties. Uh, and it was really the emphasis infancy of the digital advertising sort of revolution. Um, you know, and over the past 15 years it’s gotten a lot more complex. So now instead of just selling banner or display mentory, we’re selling things like native ads also, banner still exist. Um, but more rich media, uh, video in the form of pre-roll and mid-roll. Um, and that sort of refers to where the video actually takes place in the content, either before the content, during the content or after the content.
Scott Dahlgren 05:39 Um, and then of course we have things like, you know, linear television, uh, advertising, which are kind of the spots that you’ve seen, you know, for the last 30 years on television sets. Um, and now those are also getting more digital. So they’re turning into things like addressable advertising. So the really changed over the last 15 to 20 years and it, and it’s poised to change even more over the next 10 years. Um, so I can kind of talk a little bit about how it’s going to change and then, you know, share some of the acronyms as well. Um, but it’s probably better to lay a little bit of foundation in terms of how it’s all coming together and how people are using it.
Jeff Byer 06:17 Yeah. Cause this, this, uh, audience for digital rage is digital marketer marketers. So it’s people doing mostly online, uh, PPC or anything using digital properties. So, um, one thing that’s come up is how much, how much is programmatic and how much is, is, uh, manual placement. How much programmatic do you do?
Scott Dahlgren 06:41 Uh, well when I joined, uh, direct TV about five years ago, we did very little to no programmatics. So primarily we were selling at that point, addressable television, uh, against direct TV’s, addressable television audience. So to put it in context, direct TV is the largest pay TV service in the United States. Uh, at T and T is the second largest wireless service in the United States. And then <inaudible> and then, uh, the third largest broadband service in the United States with at and T broadband. So we have a lot of different platforms to sell off of. Um, and the programmatic part of that is really consists of the digital video area. So within digital video, indirect TV, you’re talking about things like TV everywhere, which is direct TVs, uh, kind of lap top based service that allows you to watch your direct TV, not on your conventional living room television, but maybe on your mobile device or your, uh, iPhone.
Scott Dahlgren 07:40 Um, so we sell programmatic inventory against that product and also against our other OTT products. Things like watch TV, which is yet another OTT service that we offer with at and T wireless subscriptions. And then yet a third service called DirecTV now, which is sort of a, uh, you know, basically a direct TV light. It’s for people who don’t want the satellite dish on their roof, don’t want the set top box, but still want access to the direct TV programming. Uh, people who maybe have a sling or a Hulu account, but are typically cord cutters and cord nevers, they would sign up for that service. So on all three of those services, watch TV, direct TV, now TV everywhere we sell pre-roll and mid-roll advertising. So these are 15 or 30 seconds video spots, um, that you can buy across the 75 networks that we insert those spots on ’em.
Scott Dahlgren 08:29 And you can buy that in either a direct IO fashion, which is kind of your old contract based transaction or programmatically, which is a more auction based environment. So we started selling in, this is sort of a long winded answer to your question, but it gets to kind of how it all kinda came into place in the first place. Uh, we sell against those, uh, those video properties in those two ways on a direct IO basis or a programmatic basis in each one of those ways. Different kind of benefits to them, um, depending on pricing and how you want your inventory to fill, um, you know, and targeting. But, uh, essentially those are the two modalities that we sell. Digital video again,
Jeff Byer 09:09 that’s true. And are the big brands doing any type of live testing or do their videos already go through focus groups? And what you get is final, final across all media.
Scott Dahlgren 09:20 Typically we’ll, you know, being one of the largest advertising companies in the world where we’re working with fortune 500 companies who generally have their creative figured out, they understand who they want to reach from a targeting perspective and they’re coming to us to, um, you know, see how we can reach that target. Um, and that’s where things get even more complex because we kind of differentiate ourselves in the marketplace with respect to our data. So we have, as the, you know, us as biggest TV service, the second largest wireless, third largest broadband, we have basically a 170 million people across the United States who have a billing subscriber relationship with us. So that gives us tremendous first party deterministic targeting capabilities. And when we say first-party and deterministic, we basically mean we know these people, they give us their billing information, we know their address, we know how many people are in their household.
Scott Dahlgren 10:19 Some basic credit credit information. Um, and so we basically use those 170 million targeting relationships to create ID graphs. So things around geolocation data from U a T and T wireless device. Where are you aware, have you been, uh, viewership data? What are you watching on direct TV? Uh, and then we can also target by mobile search and browsing history. So what have you looked up on your at and T wireless devices? So if you imagine combining all three of those different targeting variables, you can get really specific. You know, if you’re looking for, if you’re Alexis and you’re looking to target somebody who’s in market for a new car, one target could be people who’ve looked up luxury cars on their cell phone for the last three months. That’s simple enough for us to do a, but then a whole nother target could be, well, we want to target people who’ve looked up luxury cars at least three times in the last 30 days and also have been to a dealer lot. Well, that could be a whole different targeting segment for somebody who’s much further down the purchasing funnel. Um, so we can create a lot of really specific and powerful targeted targeting segments based on our subscriber relationships in first party.
Jeff Byer 11:25 Are you using, so this is a thing that Google started implementing. Are you using geotargeting based on cell phone location too to verify business visits?
Scott Dahlgren 11:37 There are a lot of different ways that we can use geolocation. Uh, we used to outsource it to companies like placed or place IQ, um, who basically use apps on phones to make a determination on where people are or have been. Uh, now we don’t have to, since we’re a third of the wireless population, we basically have geolocation data across a third of the wireless population, which is huge. It’s over a hundred million us citizens. So, uh, we’ll use that in a lot of cases. Um, you know, but there are other ways we can establish a person’s location, whether it’s, you know, if we want to target them at home, we obviously know their billing address. Uh, so it kind of depends on the client and the campaign and what they’re looking not only to target, but then how they’re looking on the back end. Uh, you know, what KPIs are they looking to read?
Jeff Byer 12:23 Yeah. Cause a retargeting is, is you know, the flagship portion of any paid ad on online and digital for, for digital marketers. So, so, um, retargeting is how aggressive is it compared to, you know, online retargeting and in your industry, I think it’s a little bit <inaudible> different.
Scott Dahlgren 12:43 So, um, you know, when we’re selling our inventory, we’re not doing it as much online. Our, our, our biggest source of advertising is really addressable. Uh, and that’s running across DirecTV has about 23 million subscriber households, of which about 16 to 17 million are addressable households. To be addressable, you have to have a set top box that allows for addressable advertising. So basically an HD DVR set top box. So that’s why it’s not the full 23 million. Um, but when we’re running addressable ads, frequency management is much more important than retargeting. So we can actually say within a three to four week flight that you want to reach a user, you know, four times a week or three times a week, uh, in a typical frequency over a four week flight. Might be 16 exposures. Uh, what I think we use more than retargeting in the addressable television world is attribution.
Scott Dahlgren 13:36 So when we’re doing an addressable campaign, and we’ll, we’ll just keep with the auto examples. Uh, if we’re targeting people who are in market for a luxury car, uh, we might say, okay, we have found 3 million of our 16 million addressable households that their leases expiring in the next 60 days. And they are in market for a luxury car because we know they’ve had a luxury car in the past. Um, so if we find 3 million of those households, what we’ll do is we’ll hold out 10% of that group. So we’ll serve an ad to, you know, the 2 million and change, uh, and then hold out the, the 10%. So, you know, 200,000 in this case or 300,000. I said 3 million, um, and not serve them an ad. And then we can look basically throughout the course of the flight and then maybe 30 to 60 days after the flight, depending on how long we do, sort of a post attribution window on car purchases.
Scott Dahlgren 14:27 So, you know, did the people who were exposed to the ad purchase a car more than the same target group that was not exposed to the ad? And then we can actually show a lift in car purchases. Um, that’s a very simple explanation. That’s kind of what we did four years ago. We’ve gotten a little bit more sophisticated with our attribution in the year sense. Um, so now for example, we might say, look, it’s job to get them onto the car dealer lot, but it’s sort of your job to sell them the car. So now for an attribution on an addressable campaign, we might look at something like, did they visit the dealer live, you know, using that same control and exposed methodology. So a little less about retargeting since we’re not in an online forum where people kind of come back in that way, but more about attribution.
Jeff Byer 15:12 Okay. And, and you, in that answer, you also explained how, how you, uh, how, how you determine something like a conversion metric. Uh, and I, you know, trying to use the mass as to, uh, determine a purchase, the, the purchasing and the, the return on investment.
Scott Dahlgren 15:33 Absolutely. And it doesn’t even have to necessarily be a purchase. It could be a website visitation, it could be a dealer visit like we said, or an actual car purchase. It really just depends on what the client wants to measure. Uh, and more often we’re doing things like brand studies too. So a company will say, well, we want to see how the exposed group views our brand as a whole. You know, do they have unaided awareness? Do they have aided awareness? What’s their affinity with the brand? Uh, their likelihood to recommend it to a friend. We can also measure all that stuff against that same control and exposed a user base on addressable. So again, it’s a little bit different than what your audience is probably used to hearing in terms of just the kind of searched based and social base, digital marketing. But, um, but they do have very similar characteristics in that you can do full funnel attribution analysis. You can do brand health studies and things like that.
Jeff Byer 16:24 All right. So, uh, should we get into some, some acronyms? Sure. Yeah. All right. There’s a lot of them. All right. So, uh, what, what do you got on the top of your list?
Scott Dahlgren 16:35 So, uh, I mean, programmatic is, has really taken off in the last couple of years now that we have more and more digital video supply sources since we launched these new products like direct TV now and watch TV. Uh, again, we’re selling that digital video inventory more frequently and we’re doing it programmatically. So a lot of times when we’re selling a programmatic campaign, we will set up a PNP, which is a private marketplace auction. This basically allows our clients to bid on this inventory in a private kind of reserved auction. Um, they could use a DSP that we have, uh, or they could use their own DSP. And that’s, uh, the demand side platform. So those are companies like trade desk or a mobi or oath or DV three 60, which is Google’s product, which is a big out here on the West coast or they could use app nexus.
Scott Dahlgren 17:27 Our DSP is actually called invest, uh, which we just launched recently as well. Uh, the demand side platform is basically a user interface that allows people to auction that inventory in a private marketplace, not to be confused with an SSP, which is a supply side platform. Uh, and that is a platform that sort of sits in between the DSP and the auction where the supply sources sit. So, uh, there’s a lot of kind of acronyms just in the programmatic world, um, but also many in the addressable world as well. Um, CSX cross stream, cross screen addressable, that’s the ability for us to, you know, target all of those people who are watching direct TV on their living room. But we can also then send ads to all the mobile devices in their same household. Uh, regardless of carrier. If it’s a T and T, great, but if it’s another third party carrier, that’s fine too.
Scott Dahlgren 18:17 Uh, so cross screen CSX is, has gotten, um, quite popular in the last couple of years as well. I’m trying to think of any other ag acronyms off the top of my head. Looking at a cheat sheet here. Oh, data-driven linear DDL. That’s another popular one. So is linear television, you know, uh, gets more popular. We have products like data-driven, linear DDL. Uh, so in the past a company might want to buy mail networks, so they would just look at, okay, what are the networks that have the most males? Well, it might be the golf channel or ESPN or uh, you know, the wall street journal, news channel, whatever, or the Playboy channel or the Playboy channel. Lots of men there. Exactly. Uh, and now we, with data-driven linear, we can do that on a more scientific basis by actually looking at the users who are watching it and sampling and actual audience size and saying, we know you’re reaching at least 70% of, you know, men or women or whatever. Um, so a lot of acronyms and advertising and probably more so even at Zandra specifically just because we have so many advertising products. I think our general presentation is something like 85 slides and we sell about 22 products now. Uh, you know, not including the app nexus and the DSPs and the SSPs and, and all that good stuff.
Jeff Byer 19:39 DSPs assessed PS. I’ll just, that’s way too much
Scott Dahlgren 19:44 ID graphs, uh, you name it and Eve and then, uh, you know, data. That’s a whole nother set of acronyms. Uh, you know, we work with probably 75 different data companies, Axiom, Epsilon, Experian, uh, Polk, new star companies that a lot of people haven’t heard of, um, that are being acquired more and more by advertising agencies because they want to own a data company so that they can have their own sort of niche in terms of what they can offer to their clients. So, uh, the advertising world just in general, is filled with acronyms from the data companies to the platforms, to the products. Um, there’s, there’s lots of acronyms to go around.
Jeff Byer 20:27 All right. Well, I mean it definitely, I like how, uh, how different that, that each of these, these models is from, from, uh, online digital to, uh, what you sell, which is, you know, pretty much everything under the sun, including online, digital. So, um, for the, for the big brands, what, what trends are you seeing in, and like you mentioned at the top of show, where do you see all of this going?
Scott Dahlgren 20:53 Yeah, I mean, I think, um, you know, the trend that we’re seeing now over the last couple of years is, is basically a shift from, um, the formerly siloed way of doing business at an advertising agency or advertising client to a more integrated approach. So you used to have, for example, a digital team at an agency and maybe an advanced television buying team and then over there a programmatic team, and then you’d have a social, uh, and search team over there. Uh, what they’re finding is that they’re needing to work together, uh, more collaboratively. They’re all fighting for budget, of course, for each of their different teams, but often not looking at the overall bigger advertising pictures. So what the trend now is, is really more about measuring the unique reach across these different platforms and devices and trying to figure out what the most effective mix of that media is.
Scott Dahlgren 21:47 Um, so it may be that you know, you’re reaching the majority of your people effectively just by buying addressable television and you don’t need to run as much search or social or your audience may be more millennial focused. And so you need to run more search and social social to, to reach them because they’re watching less TV. So we’re seeing a lot of different companies kind of pop up that will measure where people are truly consuming media and what the best mix should be to reach them. Um, but we’re also seeing clients get more sophisticated and bringing a lot of this stuff in house as well. Uh, relying a little bit less on agencies because agencies basically have their own products that they want to sell that may not be in the best interest of the client. Um, you know, IPG bought Axiom, publicists bought Epsilon, Dentsu bought Merkel, WPP bought Vaxis.
Scott Dahlgren 22:41 Well, all of those agencies will want to use the companies that they paid billions of dollars for. And the clients are well aware of that. So they’re a little bit skeptical sometimes. So we’re seeing a little bit more push back from the client in terms of how best to use data and what media mix to to reach. But really things are just evolving so quickly, uh, in this space. I think there’s really just been a data kind of revolution in the last five years. Uh, that’s both good and bad, but it’s just changed a lot of the marketplace. And then of course, you know, as you know better than anyone that the way people consume content is changing. So trying to chase consumers across these different devices, um, is complex as well.
Jeff Byer 23:21 Yeah. And one thing I noticed a, especially through the, uh, the GumGum relationship is that, uh, when I first started with you and at gum gum, it was mostly entertainment, uh, work that I was getting. And slowly I niched down into automotive. And from what I can tell is that automotive, just, they advertise anywhere and no, and just spray it out there to see what works. And they’re still doing that. And I think that’s one of the only industries that I see that still does that. Are you seeing that as well?
Scott Dahlgren 23:57 Um, yeah, on products like GumGum, I think they are a little more receptive to opening up the targeting because they’re not spending as much budget there. Uh, when they’re, you know, putting a $6 million television investment down, they’re getting really targeted, you know, they’re looking for people not only who’s lease expires in the next 90 day, but you know, people who’ve purchased Alexis two times in the past, for example, that could actually be a target. We want somebody who’s purchased Alexis at least two times in the past and whose lease is expiring. So, you know, on one platform you may have a much wider reach campaign, uh, because the cost and benefit is there. But then on another platform you may have a much more targeted approach. So it really kinda just depends on where they’re running. But, um, yeah, we do see different kind of targeting strategies based on the platforms that they’re running. No doubt.
Jeff Byer 24:52 Yeah, they’re definitely doing, uh, location targeting and, and so, um, you know, their, their dealer specific and then region specific and then national and national usually matches what their national television creative is. It’s just kind of a mirror of what they’re doing there.
Scott Dahlgren 25:08 Yeah. The dealer autos associations will have their own kind of tier two auto budgets and so they will run a lot more regional and local campaigns that are maybe a little less widely targeted because they are geographically regional. So they don’t need to be as targeted for, for other things. Yeah. Yeah. And then the other thing I guess I would say is just in general, in terms of targeting, it’s a, it’s a little bit like back in, I don’t know when it was probably when we were kids. W w do we have like four major broadcast channels when we were kids? Or is that,
Jeff Byer 25:41 I just go by channels. So we had a two, four, five, seven, 11 and 30.
Scott Dahlgren 25:47 Yeah. So basically you’re talking about CBS, NBC, Fox. Um, and ABC, right? The regional Katy LA and yeah, but again, it was, you know, maybe you had, I don’t know, 12 different channels. And now today on my DirecTV service, I have something like 230 channels. So you know, each of whom are also trying to sell ads on their platform. Uh, so I guess the point I was going to make is it’s what we’re seeing right now is something akin to that only in terms it’s not in terms of actual channels, it’s in terms of devices. So, you know, back in the day you might have had direct TV, Comcast charter, um, and you know, maybe I’ll tease or whatever. The four big, you know, or five big cable and satellite operators were, uh, now you’ve got Hulu, you’ve got sling, you’ve Disney plus, you’ve got a T and T, T V, now you’ve got Apple TV coming out, um, plus up 50 others that I can’t even think of off the top of my head. So now there’s almost as many distribution platforms as there were cable networks, you know, kind of, uh, when we were in our teenagers. So as that number keeps growing, it’s just getting more and more fragmented. Uh, so it’s a really interesting
Jeff Byer 27:06 time right now. So let’s say, uh, watching on a, on a disconnected device, say that, uh, I hooked my TV TV up to a, uh, a digital antenna and I’m watching NBC, uh, D does that just fall into a black hole of tracking?
Scott Dahlgren 27:22 Yeah. Well, not necessarily. Um, basically, so, you know, we sell basic advertising across all of the network. So the way it works for direct TV is we basically get two minutes of advertising per hour of content to sell. And that’s where we sell either, you know, our linear addressable advertising. Typically there’s six, 13 minutes of advertising to sell per hour of video content. So NBC, ABC, Fox, CVS are all selling that themselves. We actually don’t insert on the four major locals, uh, or the four major broadcast, rather not locals, but broadcast. Uh, and that’s pretty typical for most paid TV providers. So if you’re running off a digital antenna, again, long answer to your question, but if you’re running off a digital antenna, uh, chances are, uh, NBC has selling that directly. If you’re watching on general four, uh, and what type of targeting they can do based on that is probably more limited than what we can do. Um, if we were to sell on that, which we don’t because it’s one of the four major broadcasts, but, uh, because we just have a lot more information than they do if it’s running off in it.
Jeff Byer 28:27 Gotcha. So the most information they can get on a digital antenna is probably the antenna that’s producing the feed and go get a general area
Scott Dahlgren 28:37 <inaudible> information. Uh, you know, and then you could assume just basic demographics based on who watches, you know, a local broadcast channel. But it would, it would be definitely less specific than if, uh, if we were selling it, um, or, or anybody else on a, on a pay TV service just because there’s that extra chain of custody in terms of who’s who signed up for the service, where they live, billing information, all that kind of stuff.
Jeff Byer 29:01 Okay. So now I have one last question as far as targeting, uh, people are tracking, uh, tracking, reporting, things like that. What, how, how well do you think you are able to tell group viewing, you know, things like bars and restaurants and places like that, or big sporting events like the super bowl where you may not get, you’ll have way more eyeballs than you do? Uh, devices.
Scott Dahlgren 29:30 Yeah. Um, I, we basically kind of follow the general statistics that the, you know, the Nielsen’s of the world’s put out. Uh, there’s a lot of Forester research and things like that. I, you know, I think it down to something like an average of 2.5 people watching any show at a given time on a television platform, a little bit less. So with CTV, maybe it’s like two people watching at a time. And then of course on a mobile and desktop, it’s, it’s a one to one relationship. You usually don’t gather around that type of screen. Um, so, you know, we, when we’re selling advertising, it’s on an impression basis and it’s really only for that one person that we’re targeting. But we do know that there’s a lot of ancillary benefit to the people who are also in the room watching television in bars. That’s even more exacerbated because you potentially have hundreds of people in a bar.
Scott Dahlgren 30:18 Um, and we’re very fortunate as DirecTV because we’re in 90% of the bars in the United States because we’re NFL Sunday ticket. So, uh, we have a lot of reach there as well. Um, but yeah, there’s that, that question comes up quite a bit and, um, there’s definitely a lot of co viewing going on. Uh, the other thing that’s going on that we get even asked even more isn’t so much how many people are gathered around the television set, but how many people are watching TV while also looking at a tablet or phone? Um, and then that’s where cross screen advertising comes into play. Again, that ability to send that addressable message on day one and then maybe on day two of the campaign, follow that message up with an ad on their mobile device. Um, so that, that comes up quite a bit as well. And then of course, we track all of it as well.
Jeff Byer 31:02 Okay. Well there you have it. Um, all right. Uh, follow up. What do you, uh, do you have anything from out where people follow you? Uh, what’s your address? Um, how do you, how do you get into your car? What do you, if you, uh, looking for any addressable advertising solutions? It’s Scott dot firstname.lastname@example.org. Yeah. And I watched that video, uh, that I helped you cut down. Uh, the video. Zander w is a basically a, uh, modified abbreviation of, uh, Alexander Graham bell. Oh, that’s right. Yeah.
Scott Dahlgren 31:40 Yes. We’re going back to our roots. So Alexander Graham bell invented the telephone, uh, and we thought it would be cool to go back to our roots and named the company’s Zander. Uh, I think we also looked at a bunch of other names. The, I think ampersand was up there because of the, and, and at. T and T a there were, they tested quite a few, but Zander is where we landed. We’re going back,
Jeff Byer 32:03 do our roots. We’re cool. And we’re now hip. We’re not just a, uh, you know, copper line based telephone company anymore. Now we’re at real digital cool company like Google. Yes. And you’ve got a very cool branding and merge. That’s a big thing in your area. Industry merge. Lots of jackets and lots of swag. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1 32:25 Alright, my man. Thanks for coming to the office. Thanks for talking to us and uh, yeah, it’s been a digital rage. Thanks Jeff for show notes and information. Go to the digital rage.fm. Follow us on Twitter and Instagram at digital rage at bam. And please give us a rating review is really appreciate it.